Can you download / steal / find my .flv?

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Mar. 13, 2009Jarrod Miles

These past few days I've been working on making it so noone can find my .flv file, nor download it. (Obviously I can't prevent screen capture).

Can someone please test what I've done, and inform me if they can either download the *correct* flv, or find the filename / location of the flv?

You should notice that if you try to capture the flv using a simple HTTP downloader (Bitcomet, GetRight, etc) you'll get a "Access Denied" flv instead.

The test url I set up is http://jet.kjhosting.com/stealmyvid.html

Let me know! Any criticism is also welcomed =)

Thanks!

Mar. 14, 2009vxe

Got very easily using a custom firefox extention with just a single click. The file downloaded as vid144.flv and was 1.1mb.

Mar. 15, 2009Jarrod Miles

Yeah, did you read what I wrote, and actually watch the video? You downloaded the "Access Denied" .flv.

Quote- "You should notice that if you try to capture the flv using a simple HTTP downloader (Bitcomet, GetRight, etc) you'll get a "Access Denied" flv instead."
Watch the video, it'll be an 'Access Denied' flv.

Thanks for trying though. Anyone else?


The "wrong" FLV is 1.1mb, and the correct flv is around 20MB.

Mar. 17, 2009bNj

Page not found, i will try

Mar. 17, 2009jimmyD

ROFL

in my browser cache

3,785,790 bytes

want me email it to you?

Mar. 17, 2009Jarrod Miles

Ahh my bad. Stupid me.

Try again =)

Thank for your help! It shouldn't cache now ;-)

Mar. 18, 2009jimmyD

easily grabbed by Orbit Downloader...

Mar. 18, 2009Jarrod Miles

@jimmyD

Thanks for that- just wondering, can not every video be easily grabbed with Orbit Downloader? This would go in the "can't prevent" basket yeah? Along with screen capture?

Do you know of a way to prevent Orbit Downloader from being able to capture it?

Mar. 18, 2009jimmyD

 
To play a video/audio file, it has to be downloaded to the client computer. At that point it's trivial to capture the media file.

Mar. 18, 2009Jarrod Miles

Right- so I can't stop screen capture or orbit downloader or the like. Thanks jimmyD.

Noone's still been able to find the location of my flv or downloaded it any other way?

Mar. 18, 2009jimmyD

Setup a little $$ incentive and we'll find it any way you want.

Otherwise, it's been downloaded, can always be downloaded, so why bother?

Mar. 21, 2009CHELVN

can u tell me?
thx

Mar. 21, 2009Khan

http://www.donationcoder.com/Software/Mouser/urlsnooper/index.html

Found it in seconds

Mar. 22, 2009Jarrod Miles

@Khan- Found the location of the video? Or just grabbed the video file? If you found the location, can you please post it for me.

Thanks =)

Edit: I just had a quick look at UrlSnooper- and all I could find from that was the .swf file for the flash player, or the "Incorrect" flv. Am I missing something?

Mar. 22, 2009jimmyD

 
       "Am I missing something?"
 
 
      Yeah, our incentive $$$$$!  

Mar. 23, 2009Jarrod Miles

@jimmyD- sorry man. I don't have any money to offer. I'm trying to start a small business at the moment, but don't have an income yet.

Wish I could offer you some $$ to help out. Was just hoping that someone out there could help without getting paid.

Thanks.

Mar. 23, 2009jimmyD

We're just kidding. We do this for entertainment, NOT $$.

Mar. 24, 2009Jarrod Miles

Thanks =)

So this is what I've concluded so far-
I can't stop screen capture, Orbit Downloader or those similar which simply capture the video as it's being downloaded.

But no-one can download my video any other way, or more importantly, find the actual location or name of my video?

Thanks again for your help!

Mar. 26, 2009JeroenW

Note that a setup like this is very difficult to scale. If all your videos have to be proxied through a PHP script, you need a lot of server capacity if, for example, you run a popular UGC site.

For a low-traffic site this might be a solution though. Note that any kind of serverscript will do a similar trick, as long as:
* The key/request to grab a video is always a one-time one.
* The video always autostarts, so someone won't be able to reconstruct the url before the player has requested it.

Mar. 26, 2009Jarrod Miles

Thanks JereonW. If the amount of videos I was dishing out did grow exponentially- is there a better way to do this?

I'm selling this primarily to schools which need to obey copyright laws and can't upload their videos to youtube or the like, and need to make it so that a random stranger can't grab the embed code.
In saying that- is there a better way?

Thanks.

Mar. 30, 2009blindeyed

I used my download helper extension for Firefox. Downloaded a 3.61mb video called vid144.flv. It was not the "Access Denied" video you were talking about, it was some religious classroom preaching video.

As far as the location of the file, this is all I got using that same extension:
http://media.kjhosting.com/get_video.php.test?vid=144.flv

Mar. 30, 2009Jarrod Miles

Thanks blindeyed.
So it seems that there are several firefox (and other browser) extensions or the like that can capture the video as it's coming in. I don't see how anyone would be able to prevent that? Unless I'm wrong?

In it's real setting (rather than at my test page I set up) people can only get to the page showing the video providing they have correct permissions given to them by their administrator.

So in saying that, considering you cannot use the embed code in another website, or link to my flv in any other way, And if you want to capture it, you'll have to have permission to access the video anyway- I think it seems pretty safe?

Comments?

Thanks again for people's help.

Apr. 30, 2009elvino

What codes are you using to protect your flv files? I would like to securely protect my video files (like you have done) but I'm not too sure how to go about it.

May. 03, 2009David James

Is the primary issue that one person may download the video file and share it, or that someone will build a link that can be shared so that everyone can download a fresh copy of it?

Since the trailer makes it seem to be a course on Christianity and understanding the reach of God in all directions, possibly some other "higher power" could be applied to keep the students honest? (heh)

If the test of "is this steal-able?" is going to be "can a member of Anonymous grab the file and upload it to YouTube?" then I think you may be out of luck.

It makes a difference on the approach: if the intent is to make sure no revenue is lost due to viewers that would have paid but managed to get it for free, then you can probably clamp it down well enough. If the intention is to keep idiots (that would not be potential paying customers) from seeing it, or making copies, then it is much tougher.

You could do multiple levels of security: trusted network+trusted device+trusted user, but this can get a bit crazy, and doesn't allow the students flexibility to view the videos from alternate locations (like a Starbucks).

You COULD deliver it as a true stream, and validate not just permission on a site directory, but also against a list of valid IP addresses (or ranges) before allowing the stream.

If it is really copyright and commercial concerns, then the school will likely only need to show that it exercised due dilligence in keeping the files secure. I think you have already got enough in place for that.

One thing I WILL recommend: Get the versions that you will be hosting to have some sort of a watermark or key, so that if the videos manage to show up on YouTube or bitTorrent or somewhere, you can figure out if it came from your copies, or another source. It would be a shame to go to all of this trouble to lock it down and still get a finger pointed at you, when the leaked video came from someone else's server.

May. 03, 2009idiots

The "idiots" know how to remove watermarks, so don't crap up your video with them.

The best way to prevent downloading/leeching is to make your content so worthless that no one wants it. Turn on your TV and select any channel at random for examples.

May. 04, 2009elp

everything that people see on a website, it means it downloadable if they know how...

@idiots
i think jarrod's talking about how to download a"hidden" flv,worthless or not, it's about perception.

hope anyone could understand my english.

May. 16, 2009Sam

Hi I have a library of my educational videos -now I want to setup my membership site, I need to protect my files from downloading by real player or other similar software when the member watch it.
means the member can only watch the video but cant download it.
appreciate any help.

May. 22, 2009travis

i was looking for a way to download a video that orbit wasn't seeing, found this thread and then the download helper extension for firefox and that did the job. thanks!

Jun. 09, 2009huan

If it's out there, as one said, it can be downloaded. You just need to know how to. At the moment, with the downloadhelper firefox extension I managed to download even imeem FULL MP3 and Videos without paying!

I sent them an email and i am sure they are pulling their hair trying something similar to the idea behind this thread!

Jun. 26, 2009Psyke

I have been trying to find a way to download and save the vids over at Kelby Training, I have paid up membership and subscription so Im not just stealing their vids. They have some player inside player system where Orbit, DownloadHelper and a list of other gadgets have not been able to detect the streaming video.

Any suggestions would be great cause it is such a pain having to go and stream the video everytime I want to check a technique.

Thanks

Jul. 12, 2009Pem

Orbit detects the vids at Kelbytraining with Grab++
but cant download.
Replay media catcher can but it's 40$.
Is there a way to make orbit download?
It goes:
"Connecting flashmedia.kelbymediagroup.com:1935
Connected
Wait for retry(5S)"

Jul. 15, 2009JasonAnd

Hey JimmyD I have a similar question as jarrod and if you help me out we can negotiate a price.

Aug. 03, 2009Razzorx

orbit said, the url is:
http://media.kjhosting.com/get_video.php.test?vid=144.flv&OBT_fname=get_video.php.flv

Aug. 19, 2009CJ

How did you prevent it from being downloadable?

I'm currently setting up an eLearning training website with flash videos, and even with water marks I don't want it downloadable.

Aug. 19, 2009lost

@CJ,

You should use Flash Media Server and one of the encrypted/secure RTMP formats.

Anything else is downloaded to play and can be found in the browser's cache or grabbed by a downloader, such as Orbit or rtmpdump.

Aug. 22, 2009Blackmind

He man,

Dumper DATA from firefox addon, in fact this program its a head pain for programers... whit that program theres no way do hide anything

:/

Aug. 22, 2009Vicky Holmes

Jarrod Miles Super Thread!

Aug. 28, 2009nick

user unlocker and copy it out of %tmp%

Sep. 24, 2009Flintsoft

Hello

we are in same issue ,Can you forward the technology or the coding support to protect the videos,We realy need ur support

Regards
flintsoft

Sep. 24, 2009Flintsoft

Hello

Jerrold miles

We are redy to pay for your technology ,We are really strugling on with real player,if you can plese support me as early as posible

Sep. 24, 2009Nyarlathotep

It's pretty much impossible to prevent downloading of your videos, however in certain circumstances you can prevent others from playing them.

If you know the URL your video should be played from (ie. you are hosting a video or are selling it to someone playing it from a known URL), you can use some ActionScript to check that the _root.url is in fact this site (if it isn't, halt playing the video). Then use an obfuscator (like SecureSWF) on the file so that if it's decompiled, the _root.url check cannot be removed.

Obfuscators can probably be broken, but I've not seen any evidence of a known crack for the likes of SecureSWF.

Sep. 26, 2009skinny

Only secure RTMP formats, used by hulu and the likes are close to impossible, remember I said close and not completely. I can't find a way to "grab" those, (other than screen capture) but then again, i am the 'village idiot'. Has any one figured those out???.

Sep. 26, 2009noMind

flvstreamer/rtmpdump

Oct. 28, 2009canuckcorbin

I'll award 100 intewebs points to anyone who can steal the livebooks.com templates.

(ie: http://www.stevecohenphoto.com and http://www.joeschmelzer.com/ )

I've tried the aforementioned techniques and come up with nothing. I would really like to rip these flash templates and torrent them out to the interested community.

Good luck.

Nov. 03, 2009Doraemon

Hi Nyarlathotep, You said is impossible to prevent people to download FLV. any solution for paid viewing service? meaning if have to paid to view that video and must be member login.

Nov. 19, 2009Hoda A

I could`t download or find it, how do you protect the source using iframe? i need it for my site :-)

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